I asked him the same question in a different thread. Here is a copy of our conversation.
@MDBuds,
What do you think the best way to extract cannabinoid‘s without decarboxylation? I was thinking about trying to cold alcohol extract for several weeks or months in a dark cool place. High proof ETOH. But I’m thinking I want to keep it in THCA and not converted to THCV at all. or as little as possible. I’ve been reading a lot of the results of Israeli studies and they are saying that THCA is surprisingly good at fucking up cancer cells; …moving to clinical studies. Seems to conclude that thca by chance seemed to be especially good for cancer.
With the irony being that virtually nobody consumes it that way. If you’re heating it to decarboxylate by smoking, oven, or vape.
Cancer runs in my family so I found that particularly interesting anyway I guess. Unless you fresh juice it with flowers and leaves (whole plant) is there a good way to do it? Concentrating it without any breaking in the carboxyl is what I am thinking. What are your thoughts? Thoughts or any tips are always appreciated. I love your insight…
Or a cold press rosin for extraction. Were you could dissolve it in the high proof EtOH.? Or set it on the back of the tongue as a lingual?
MDBuds
Nov '21
@Noddykitty firstly there is a chemical difference between thc and thcv. Thca does not convert into thcv it converts into thc. Thcva is the carboxyl acid form of thcv. Thc and thcv have similar properties and effects but they also vary greatly and have different medicinal uses etc… thc is a pentyl carbon chain where as thcv is a propyl carbon chain. THCV is also federally legal and legal in 38 states where as thc is illegal federally.
Now with that said in order to answer your question properly I need to know if you want information on THC or THCV.
As far as the other cannabinoids and terpenes cold alcohol extraction is one of the best methods. It will not convert thca, thcva, or cbda without heat though you might still get some conversion because of age and oxidation before you begin the alcohol extraction.
For cold extraction with alcohol a minimum set time of 3 hours with agitation is needed. The longer you let it set though the more it will pull out. If you let it sit a long time make sure you shake it a bit and agitate it every day. Once it sets long enough to extract everything you can do a cold evap and filter process like what I do. Filter it into a clean container through organic unbleached coffee filters and let it set in a cool dark area and let the alcohol evaporate off until it reaches the consistency you desire.
My personal preferred method is to use a soxhlet extractor on low heat with non denatured alcohol 95% or greater. Just let it run until the drip runs clear. It operates at a low enough temperature it will not decarb anything.
As far as the medicinal benefits it all depends on the type of cancer and delivery method. Lab studies are great but it shows the effectiveness in a petri dish not in the human body. So it would be difficult to suggest which delivery method to use without knowing the type of cancer etc…
Sublingual dosing can be effective if you let it set under your tongue long enough to absorb.
Yes, you can make great tinctures with cold pressed rosin by putting the rosin in alcohol or a carrier oil. I do this myself with cold pressed fresh flower rosin on occasion.
If I missed something or anymore clarification is needed on your end feel free to ask. This is a good discussion to have.
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Noddykitty
Nov '21
I am referring to just to thca in the raw form. I incorrectly thought that thcv is an intermediary short lived form between thca and thc. I did not realize it was its own separate isomer. My bad.
You are also right about specific cancers. The study had focused on colon cancer specifically and 1 type of breast cancer. I was thinking whole body wellness it could not hurt to have some thca floating around in the body.?
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MDBuds
Nov '21
@Noddykitty as far as whole body wellness is concerned no it won’t hurt at all. THCa and CBDa both have medicinal benefits outside of their effectiveness at killing cancer cells. They both have Anti-inflammatory properties, anti-nausea properties, and neuroprotectant properties.
THCa and CBDa may even be better than their active counterparts THC and CBD at treating some of these.
It’s why I personally mix fresh flower with my decarbed flower usually. Best of both worlds.
Also, as you previously mentioned that I forgot to comment on, juicing fresh flower and making smoothies with it is definitely a great delivery method. Aside from just having loads of terpenes you also get a lot of the chlorophyll and anthocyanins/carotenoids which are extremely beneficial for cancer fighting and immune system health.
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Noddykitty
Nov '21
Interesting, so when I add raw flower to my finished decarboxylated oil to infuse terpenes again, I am also infusing thca and cbda. I didn’t think about that.
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MDBuds
Nov '21
@Noddykitty yeah that’s exactly what you’re doing.
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I think I’m going to add some not-de-carbed weed as well anyway.
Yeah I just looked at the recipe again and it actually calls for 1/2 cup of oil altogether. So that’s like a 1/4oz per pan at this rate.